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	<title>Comments on: Plus ça change, plus c’est la même chose…</title>
	<atom:link href="http://news.opensuse.org/2011/04/06/plus-ca-change-plus-cest-la-meme-chose/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://news.opensuse.org/2011/04/06/plus-ca-change-plus-cest-la-meme-chose/</link>
	<description>The latest news from the openSUSE project</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sun, 19 May 2013 23:57:16 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: mecry</title>
		<link>http://news.opensuse.org/2011/04/06/plus-ca-change-plus-cest-la-meme-chose/comment-page-1/#comment-32021</link>
		<dc:creator>mecry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Jul 2011 17:34:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://news.opensuse.org/?p=8366#comment-32021</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[can you send me a installer for opensuse? i need to learn. thanks]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>can you send me a installer for opensuse? i need to learn. thanks</p>
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		<title>By: SteveB</title>
		<link>http://news.opensuse.org/2011/04/06/plus-ca-change-plus-cest-la-meme-chose/comment-page-1/#comment-31821</link>
		<dc:creator>SteveB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Jun 2011 18:58:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://news.opensuse.org/?p=8366#comment-31821</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[@theGryphon, that was an excellent post, you made a number of great points I hadn&#039;t even thought of after reading the article. I have to say, though, I really don&#039;t like the numbering scheme you proposed - it&#039;s the most confusing yet! To me it seems to suggest that there are 3 different streams of development, N, J and M. If the numbers and letters were the other way round, i.e. 1.N, 1.J, 1.M, it wouldn&#039;t be so misleading, but it&#039;s still not immediately obvious which is the latest version. (And it looks ugly this way round) Another problem, less obvious perhaps, is that M and N both look and sound similar, which doesn&#039;t help with version differentiation. 

Might I suggest we adopt the brilliant Ubuntu numbering system, or at least fix the new system so that the major number reflects the year? If we did that, the version numbers would be: 11.2, 12.1, 13.1, 13.2, 14.1, 15.1, 15.2. Not great either, I suppose, but having releases every 8 months with no major-minor version divide does make designing a good numbering system a challenge.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@theGryphon, that was an excellent post, you made a number of great points I hadn&#8217;t even thought of after reading the article. I have to say, though, I really don&#8217;t like the numbering scheme you proposed &#8211; it&#8217;s the most confusing yet! To me it seems to suggest that there are 3 different streams of development, N, J and M. If the numbers and letters were the other way round, i.e. 1.N, 1.J, 1.M, it wouldn&#8217;t be so misleading, but it&#8217;s still not immediately obvious which is the latest version. (And it looks ugly this way round) Another problem, less obvious perhaps, is that M and N both look and sound similar, which doesn&#8217;t help with version differentiation. </p>
<p>Might I suggest we adopt the brilliant Ubuntu numbering system, or at least fix the new system so that the major number reflects the year? If we did that, the version numbers would be: 11.2, 12.1, 13.1, 13.2, 14.1, 15.1, 15.2. Not great either, I suppose, but having releases every 8 months with no major-minor version divide does make designing a good numbering system a challenge.</p>
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		<title>By: abdussamad</title>
		<link>http://news.opensuse.org/2011/04/06/plus-ca-change-plus-cest-la-meme-chose/comment-page-1/#comment-31816</link>
		<dc:creator>abdussamad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Jun 2011 11:01:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://news.opensuse.org/?p=8366#comment-31816</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I think 12 months would be ideal for a stable but up to date desktop OS but 8 months is good too. Definitely better than Fedora&#039;s 6 months which is too rapid IMO.

If users are really interested in an LTS release they can always roll their own version like centos. But OpenSUSE is desktop oriented and I like that about it.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think 12 months would be ideal for a stable but up to date desktop OS but 8 months is good too. Definitely better than Fedora&#8217;s 6 months which is too rapid IMO.</p>
<p>If users are really interested in an LTS release they can always roll their own version like centos. But OpenSUSE is desktop oriented and I like that about it.</p>
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		<title>By: XNM</title>
		<link>http://news.opensuse.org/2011/04/06/plus-ca-change-plus-cest-la-meme-chose/comment-page-1/#comment-31779</link>
		<dc:creator>XNM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Jun 2011 07:41:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://news.opensuse.org/?p=8366#comment-31779</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[There will be no 2013 release &#039;cause world will no longer exist as we know since dec. 2012.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There will be no 2013 release &#8217;cause world will no longer exist as we know since dec. 2012.</p>
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		<title>By: M Night Shuttleworth</title>
		<link>http://news.opensuse.org/2011/04/06/plus-ca-change-plus-cest-la-meme-chose/comment-page-1/#comment-30286</link>
		<dc:creator>M Night Shuttleworth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Apr 2011 02:38:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://news.opensuse.org/?p=8366#comment-30286</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[now that we got version numbering down, it&#039;s time for a logo contest!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>now that we got version numbering down, it&#8217;s time for a logo contest!</p>
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		<title>By: theGryphon</title>
		<link>http://news.opensuse.org/2011/04/06/plus-ca-change-plus-cest-la-meme-chose/comment-page-1/#comment-29688</link>
		<dc:creator>theGryphon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Apr 2011 14:28:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://news.opensuse.org/?p=8366#comment-29688</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I guess people asking for an LTS version for OpenSUSE got their answer. For people who don&#039;t understand/like the 8-month release cycle should plug their heads out of the sand and look around. A regular release cycle (no matter the improvement in each release) makes for a stable brand, discipline and ease of management in development, user expectation, media coverage, etc. The 8-month regular release cycle was the best thing the OpenSUSE devs held onto and I&#039;d like to congratulate them for that.

That said, I don&#039;t think they put sufficient thinking into the newly announced numbering scheme. It sounds nice and all except for one thing: in the XX.Y scheme, the XX too closely resembles the year BUT it actually does not reflect the year number. That will cause a lot of confusion in media and people. For example, 12.1 will be released in November 2011, inevitably suggesting that it will be the first release ready for year 2012 (just as in a 2012 model car). 12.2 also makes sense as it&#039;s gonna be in July 2012 but 12.3 will sound like &quot;well it&#039;s actually in series 12 but couldn&#039;t make it in year 2012&quot;. Then, 13.1 will start the real confusion: it&#039;s almost year 2014, why then 13.1.

See what I mean, it&#039;s virtually impossible to break the connection between the current numbering scheme and the actual year/time the releases will happen, AND the (perceived) inconsistency will throw a lot of people off. I just don&#039;t understand how they couldn&#039;t see this handicap (I guess the decision relied on programmers and engineers, rather than people who understands marketing and branding, no offense). Still, I don&#039;t think it&#039;s too late to make yet another change, for the sake of OpenSUSE brand. 

Hate it or not, Ubuntu actually nailed it. XX.YY in their numbering scheme perfectly reflects the release time without creating any hierarchy between the releases and any expectations as to a certain release will be major while the rest is minor.
OpenSUSE can do this too, even with 8-month cycle, and the numbering scheme does not have to reflect the year (anybody can check the calender for that). Take for example a numbering scheme based on the release month: X.Y where X is either N (for November), J (for July) or M (for March), and Y is a number indicating the order in each (release month) series. Specifically, the next release in November 2011 would be OpenSUSE N.1. Then, July 2012 release would be J.1, March 2013 would be M.1, and November 2013 would be N.2 (as in &quot;the second November release&quot;). Think with an open mind and you&#039;ll see that this scheme makes perfect sense as the releases will happen only in those three months and this way you&#039;d be creating November release series, July release series and March release series, appropriately numbered and completely detached from the year. 

My humble suggestion... and don&#039;t forget, it&#039;s never too late to correct an mistake ;)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I guess people asking for an LTS version for OpenSUSE got their answer. For people who don&#8217;t understand/like the 8-month release cycle should plug their heads out of the sand and look around. A regular release cycle (no matter the improvement in each release) makes for a stable brand, discipline and ease of management in development, user expectation, media coverage, etc. The 8-month regular release cycle was the best thing the OpenSUSE devs held onto and I&#8217;d like to congratulate them for that.</p>
<p>That said, I don&#8217;t think they put sufficient thinking into the newly announced numbering scheme. It sounds nice and all except for one thing: in the XX.Y scheme, the XX too closely resembles the year BUT it actually does not reflect the year number. That will cause a lot of confusion in media and people. For example, 12.1 will be released in November 2011, inevitably suggesting that it will be the first release ready for year 2012 (just as in a 2012 model car). 12.2 also makes sense as it&#8217;s gonna be in July 2012 but 12.3 will sound like &#8220;well it&#8217;s actually in series 12 but couldn&#8217;t make it in year 2012&#8243;. Then, 13.1 will start the real confusion: it&#8217;s almost year 2014, why then 13.1.</p>
<p>See what I mean, it&#8217;s virtually impossible to break the connection between the current numbering scheme and the actual year/time the releases will happen, AND the (perceived) inconsistency will throw a lot of people off. I just don&#8217;t understand how they couldn&#8217;t see this handicap (I guess the decision relied on programmers and engineers, rather than people who understands marketing and branding, no offense). Still, I don&#8217;t think it&#8217;s too late to make yet another change, for the sake of OpenSUSE brand. </p>
<p>Hate it or not, Ubuntu actually nailed it. XX.YY in their numbering scheme perfectly reflects the release time without creating any hierarchy between the releases and any expectations as to a certain release will be major while the rest is minor.<br />
OpenSUSE can do this too, even with 8-month cycle, and the numbering scheme does not have to reflect the year (anybody can check the calender for that). Take for example a numbering scheme based on the release month: X.Y where X is either N (for November), J (for July) or M (for March), and Y is a number indicating the order in each (release month) series. Specifically, the next release in November 2011 would be OpenSUSE N.1. Then, July 2012 release would be J.1, March 2013 would be M.1, and November 2013 would be N.2 (as in &#8220;the second November release&#8221;). Think with an open mind and you&#8217;ll see that this scheme makes perfect sense as the releases will happen only in those three months and this way you&#8217;d be creating November release series, July release series and March release series, appropriately numbered and completely detached from the year. </p>
<p>My humble suggestion&#8230; and don&#8217;t forget, it&#8217;s never too late to correct an mistake ;)</p>
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		<title>By: macias</title>
		<link>http://news.opensuse.org/2011/04/06/plus-ca-change-plus-cest-la-meme-chose/comment-page-1/#comment-29655</link>
		<dc:creator>macias</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Apr 2011 09:53:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://news.opensuse.org/?p=8366#comment-29655</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[“openSUSE releases on a fixed schedule every 8 months NO MATTER WHAT.”

You will risk your head for it?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>“openSUSE releases on a fixed schedule every 8 months NO MATTER WHAT.”</p>
<p>You will risk your head for it?</p>
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		<title>By: Joseph</title>
		<link>http://news.opensuse.org/2011/04/06/plus-ca-change-plus-cest-la-meme-chose/comment-page-1/#comment-29546</link>
		<dc:creator>Joseph</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Apr 2011 05:57:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://news.opensuse.org/?p=8366#comment-29546</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[For all those clamoring for a long-term-support version - there&#039;s SLES and SLED. Supporting versions of openSUSE for years will take away from the resources now used to develop new versions of openSUSE. Those wanting to use SUSE in a professional environment (the only realistic use case for an LTS version) can pay for that extra support, which is theoretically how it&#039;s supposed to work already. An LTS openSUSE undercuts Novell which dries up their funding for openSUSE. If you&#039;re a regular user who doesn&#039;t like to update... then don&#039;t use Tumbleweed and don&#039;t install updates. Or use Windows XP. :-) (Hey, only openSUSE 11.3 got me to upgrade my machine from XP to Linux).

Maybe to make my first contribution to open source, I&#039;ll fork openSUSE. It&#039;ll be exactly the same as mainline openSUSE, just using the old version numbering scheme. :-)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For all those clamoring for a long-term-support version &#8211; there&#8217;s SLES and SLED. Supporting versions of openSUSE for years will take away from the resources now used to develop new versions of openSUSE. Those wanting to use SUSE in a professional environment (the only realistic use case for an LTS version) can pay for that extra support, which is theoretically how it&#8217;s supposed to work already. An LTS openSUSE undercuts Novell which dries up their funding for openSUSE. If you&#8217;re a regular user who doesn&#8217;t like to update&#8230; then don&#8217;t use Tumbleweed and don&#8217;t install updates. Or use Windows XP. :-) (Hey, only openSUSE 11.3 got me to upgrade my machine from XP to Linux).</p>
<p>Maybe to make my first contribution to open source, I&#8217;ll fork openSUSE. It&#8217;ll be exactly the same as mainline openSUSE, just using the old version numbering scheme. :-)</p>
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		<title>By: Joseph</title>
		<link>http://news.opensuse.org/2011/04/06/plus-ca-change-plus-cest-la-meme-chose/comment-page-1/#comment-29544</link>
		<dc:creator>Joseph</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Apr 2011 05:50:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://news.opensuse.org/?p=8366#comment-29544</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Is one needs four-year support, buying SLED or SLES would be the best thing to do.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is one needs four-year support, buying SLED or SLES would be the best thing to do.</p>
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		<title>By: Joseph</title>
		<link>http://news.opensuse.org/2011/04/06/plus-ca-change-plus-cest-la-meme-chose/comment-page-1/#comment-29543</link>
		<dc:creator>Joseph</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Apr 2011 05:48:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://news.opensuse.org/?p=8366#comment-29543</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The obvious solution is to work twice as hard for the point zero releases so they really are major updates. :-)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The obvious solution is to work twice as hard for the point zero releases so they really are major updates. :-)</p>
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